Efforts for peace are essential to end the conflict between Russia and Ukraine, but French President Emmanuel Macron doubts that Russian President Vladimir Putin is prepared to do so.

“Considering the current situation and the evidence, I don’t see President Putin eager to pursue peace right now,” Macron mentioned in an exclusive interview with Kristen Welker, the moderator of NBC News’ “Meet the Press,” following a significant meeting at the White House on Monday. “However, perhaps I’m being too pessimistic,” he added.

He also noted, “The optimism of your president should not be underestimated. If he believes a deal is achievable, that’s excellent news, and we must do whatever possible to reach a solid agreement.”

Macron insisted that the United States must apply pressure to Russia and Putin to find a resolution, including introducing more sanctions.

Macron stated that if no advancements are made in the bilateral meeting that President Donald Trump announced between Putin and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy, and if a trilateral meeting does not materialize, “or if Russia does not adhere to this approach, then yes, we need to enhance the sanctions, both secondary and primary sanctions.”

He emphasized, “There is a clear aggressor, which is Russia—a nation that decided to cause harm, abducted children, and refused both a ceasefire and peace. Therefore, we cannot equate the situations of Ukraine and Russia.”

Macron advocated that Ukraine should receive security guarantees to deter any future Russian aggressions that might prolong the conflict or ignite a new war, following his discussions with Trump, Zelenskyy, and other leading European figures.

“If you make any peace deal without security guarantees, Russia will never respect its words, will never comply with its own commitments,” Macron said.

He said it was promising that Trump noted that one of the key points from his meeting Friday with Putin was that he had accepted security guarantees for Ukraine.

Asked about the possibility of a ceasefire, Macron said, “I do hope,” noting that Russia carried out strikes in Ukraine even as the delegation of world leaders was in the United States.

“It’s impossible for a Ukrainian president and Ukrainian officials to have talks about peace as their country is being destroyed and as their civilians are being killed,” he said.

Putin kept up the pressure in the lead-up to the talks with deadly attacks in Kharkiv and Zaporizhzhia overnight, seemingly trying to push Zelenskyy to meet what are thought to be sweeping demands for Russian-occupied territory in Ukraine.

Macron said there should not be any land swapping, as Trump has suggested, particularly because there have been long periods during the Russian-started war that its military was not able make significant gains in taking control of Ukrainian land.

“I don’t see any swap in the proposal of the Russians, except a swap in comparison with what they wanted at the beginning,” he said.

“Now, when we speak about territory, it’s for the Ukrainian president and for the Ukrainian people to discuss about it,” he said.

A heavyweight team joined Macron at the White House, including European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen, NATO Secretary General Mark Rutte, U.K. Prime Minister Keir Starmer, German Chancellor Friedrich Merz and Italian Prime Minister Giorgia Meloni, highlighting the importance of the talks.

Macron has been one of Europe’s most outspoken leaders about the war. He said in a speech in March that Russia posed a threat to the whole continent.

And on Monday, he again stressed that the threat extends well beyond Ukraine.

“What’s happening in Ukraine is extremely important for Ukrainian people, obviously, but for the whole security of Europe, because we speak about containing a nuclear power, which decided just not to respect international borders anymore. And I think it’s very important for your country, because it’s a matter of credibility,” he said. “The way we will behave in Ukraine will be a test for our collective credibility in the rest of the world.”